12 Year old Murderer

[Tipsy]

So you're a criminologist? The majority of scientists that know what they are talking about are atheists, although some are christians. Obviously you defy that rule of trusting the majority of informed people yourself. You die.

What does religion have to do with any of this? All of the information I am getting is coming from Amnesty International, the United Nations, and from published FBI reports. I do not see how religion has anything to do with it, unless you are somehow implying that if you are atheists or Christain you become automatically misinformed?.

From common sense I'd rather live longer than die sooner. People can take advantage of the rehab system. Be nice for a few years then youcould easily kill again, not saying that it isn't a good idea... There is people that deem life sentance worse than death, it's not like they denied someone a real life for years and years. So you could say eye for an eye just like in the bible . They kill they deserved to be killed. Are you going to kill anyone?

You are taking the question completely out of context. Read it again.

"Someone explain how any deterrence comes from the death penalty. It is no more effective or less effective as shown by studies than the threat of life in prison, so how is adding something with the same ability to deter crime going to add any deterrence? If you try two things that are equally effective, adding the option to our legal system to use one or the other option is not going to make it any more effective of a deterrent to crime. Someone explain to me the logic behind the death penalty being a deterrent."

If you are in prison for life, the odds are you won't be killing anyone, unless on the off chance it is a guard, or prison break, or even if it is another prisoner. Let me put it very simply. Death penalty as effective as life in prison. Adding death penalty option will not deter any more murderers than have already been deterred by life in prison, thus there is no deterrence. If you can flaw that logic please do, that is what I was trying to get you to answer with by the question.

As for the eye for an eye that was reformed when Jesus came for one thing. The other thing is unfortunately the United States government 'attempts' to seperate church and state, and using the bible is a bit too religious to get an argument from.

 

[Gimmi]

accidental death is not murder rembmer. Damn legal mumbo jumbo I cant remembmer.


If a 12year old kills someone on purpsoe. they deserve life behind bars. The death penalty is stupid.

yea its cooler to make somone suffer.
if you kill them they like just...die, no fun.

 

[TheJanitor]

As for the eye for an eye that was reformed when Jesus came for one thing. The other thing is unfortunately the United States government 'attempts' to seperate church and state, and using the bible is a bit too religious to get an argument from.

No shit, but I thought I'd throw some crap from the bible for you.

As of March 31, 1997, there were 632 inmates serving life sentences for first degree murder and 1477 inmates serving life for second degree murder, out of a total Canadian federal penitentiary population of 14,448. The total number of individuals serving life sentences for murder has increased dramatically over the past decade. From 1988 to 1991, the number of individuals serving life sentences for murder increased 21%, and between the years 1991 and 1997, there was a 4.4% increase (Correctional Service of Canada, 1997).

This says, that more and more people are getting life sentances looks like less people are being 'deterred' by it. Parole in 10-25 years, prisons are more cosy than before. Although you say crime is lower more people are serving life,

If you do not want to agree with people whose careers involve the very thing they are talking about then go ahead. So it says that only someone who is not wise, a fool, would think otherwise.

The whole religion thing I mentioned was something to do with this quote. I meant that you called yourself a fool because the majority of scientists are atheists.

 

[Tipsy]

Sorry for not responding sooner, but I haven't been home since last Thursday.

This says, that more and more people are getting life sentances looks like less people are being 'deterred' by it. Parole in 10-25 years, prisons are more cosy than before. Although you say crime is lower more people are serving life,

I am not the one 'saying it', I am only repeating what was said by the studies by the United Nations and Amnesty International. Since you want to talk about the death penalty and life in prison in Canada then I am willing to talk about that as well. One of the things that I admire about Canada is that they have abolished the death penalty. One thing that this shows through practice is that they have been able to lower murder rates without using the death penalty. If the death penalty was not more of a deterrent than life in prison then there would have been an obvious rise in murder rates, but since 1976, when the death penalty was abolished in Canada, murder rates have dropped from 2.84 per every 100,000 and in 2003 the Canadian murder rate dropped to a three decade low of 1.73 per every 100,000. I am not saying that not having the death penalty by any means lowers the murder rate because much of this can be explained through public programs, changing demographics, etc. I am just pointing out that the removal of the death penalty by no means causes a decrease in murder rates. If you want to use a country as an example for your argument then don't use Canada, if anything it shows that murder rates can be lowered without using the death penalty as a punishment.

The whole religion thing I mentioned was something to do with this quote. I meant that you called yourself a fool because the majority of scientists are atheists.

Once again, I am not the one calling anyone a fool. In the quote, the United Nations official who worked on the study said it was not 'prudent', a synonym for 'wise', to accept the hypothesis that capital punishment is any more effective than life in prison. The opposite of wise that is said when the United Nations official stated 'it is not prudent' is foolish, an antonym of wise. I was not calling anyone a fool.

As for what you actually are saying here, I do not see how not 'being' in the group would make you foolish, just not agreeing with them. The field of the atheistic scientists that dominate the scientific community is science, and for the most part I agree with them in their field. Their religion really shouldn't have any weight on how the science they work at in their career is taken.