Otmorosok and Guru

Who is right most the time in the arguments between the two?

  • GURU IS right most the time, AMERICA > russia

    Votes: 11 47.8%
  • There both idiots!!

    Votes: 8 34.8%
  • Otmorosok IS right most the time, Go MOTHERLAND!!

    Votes: 4 17.4%

  • Total voters
    23

Lights

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Originally posted by amrtin77
no lights, they attacked our military. they did a beautiful job of stayin invisible right up till they hit us early sunday without a declaration of war... strategical genius. they had a cause and they used the ultimate "if all else fails" method to get what they wanted. they made war. there is no shame in what they did to us, but what they did to chineese civilians was horrible.
Meh...

They had their "if all else fails" method of starting the war and we had ours to stop it. Many civilians died on both attacks, but there is a difference. They hit us without a declaration of war, a very cowardly move. A strategic genious? Maybe, but would have been more genious and less cowardly, had we already been at war. Though the A-bomb was possibly a cowardly move as well, at least it was during an actuall time of war...
 

amrtin77

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Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
They did declare war, before the attack there was a mix up. The declaration of war was sent before the attack but they only got the message after the attack i dont really have details of the "mix up" look that up yourself i can be arsed :p.

I was basically saying that the speed of theese planes are nothing new, we built one in the 50s that is faster than a lot of modern ones EG. f-15 and joint strike fighter.
I guess they were lucky that america was all asleep at war time... i would call sending a load of outdated planes to attack a habour a tatical "genious"

yea it is realy bad what they did to them poor civilians. It was 'revenge' against Nanjing for holding out for months against the japaneese but no reasons exist for what they did. Heres a link read it through and theres another reason the hate the yanks:http://www.ratatak.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=52 Heres a quote: "CONCLUSION

Japan is currently a member of the United Nations and in spite of this - the WORST war atrocity in living history - they have never officially apologised to China. Most Japanese of our generation are equally horrified by the behavior of their countrymen in Nanjing yet the Japanese government stays silent.

What does this say about a country that values honour above all else?"

ive read that article before and im not disagreeing with you. im simply saying they hit us without warning (that was smart on their part) and i cant blame them.

i CAN blame them for china, and im glad they never reached OUR shores with ground troops. in my opinion honor is useless in war, unless your using it to inspire your troops.
 

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Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
They did declare war, before the attack there was a mix up. The declaration of war was sent before the attack but they only got the message after the attack i dont really have details of the "mix up" look that up yourself i can be arsed :p.


No, they sent warning for the attack, and the day after America declared war on Japan


I was basically saying that the speed of theese planes are nothing new, we built one in the 50s that is faster than a lot of modern ones EG. f-15 and joint strike fighter.


Thats nice; we built one in the 1960s thats faster than everything - and its stealth

I guess they were lucky that america was all asleep at war time... i would call sending a load of outdated planes to attack a habour a tatical "genious"
The zero's were no where near outdated - perhaps the best fighter planes at the time...
 

ORC-r0x0r-ROC

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Im sure they sent it before the attack and america got news of it after heres a quote: "Talks between America and Japan collapsed in November so war now looked inevitable, and although an attack by the Japanese was expected, the location was unknown to the Americans." What plane was it? Ours were fastest at the time too, though we probally sold our technology to you, like we have done so many times... And they didnt use the zeros they used a bunch silly old bombers but they did have incredible missiles way ahead of thier time.
 

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British took some of the biggest hits in the war because of America's fat lazy government ass. We were nervous of joining a war we didn't have anything to do with. That never stopped up from assassinating other presidents to install dictators.

Russian moral wasn't at an all time high in my eyes, getting shot for retreating isnt a real good upper for going to fight a war. Russia did its best with what they had. A bad dictator, bad weather, and not so good moral. But they did do their part in liberating concentration camps.

In the big picture of the thing Russia had a big part in the war with a great victory of stalingrad(unless i am dumb and someone else helped) and invasion of berlin. Now you must remember Germans had invaded Moscow and torn the place up something awful and for the Russians to keep fighting with their capitol gone is a very good trait

HAIL THE MOTHERLAND!!!!!!!!
 

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Originally posted by Static


In the big picture of the thing Russia had a big part in the war with a great victory of stalingrad
Jebus, no one said they didnt. You are all acting like we said Russia didnt do anything, we arent. They played a very big role in the Allied victory...
 

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some people here are making the arguement that russia would of done aweful on their own.

In maybe a country vs. country war Russia vs. germany people are saying that germany would of won because russia was a weaker country... Germany did have excellent command but i think russia had man power.

But off the WW2 topic for me Russia is better than america in alot of ways.
 

ORC-r0x0r-ROC

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Even though this topic has been a good one, i was sorta aiming for the debate to contiue with the latest aircraft tech we were talking about in 'something i want to clear out' (look at my thread starter post) we are sorta running out of stuff to talk about on the WW2 topic. The F-22 raptor is less manuverable not as fast as the euro fighter and 3 times more expensive.. and we have a new g suit which enable the pilot the sustain high g-forces for a long period of time. The yanks dont have this yet but they'll nick it off us anyway, if they dont they'll develop it sooner or later as it is fairly simple technology
 

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Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
Im sure they sent it before the attack and america got news of it after heres a quote: "Talks between America and Japan collapsed in November so war now looked inevitable, and although an attack by the Japanese was expected, the location was unknown to the Americans." What plane was it? Ours were fastest at the time too, though we probally sold our technology to you, like we have done so many times... And they didnt use the zeros they used a bunch silly old bombers but they did have incredible missiles way ahead of thier time.
That was incredibly inaccurate and wrong.

Speed doesn't contribute that much in dog fights back then. The thing that really mattered was the manuverability - which the Zeros had more of than any other plane at the time. They were incredible planes, and dominated the early war. Perhaps the best in the world at the time.

America has made more technological advances than any other country has in the world. Stop acting like the UK was so far ahead of America tech wise, because they weren't - infact they were behind them. Lets not forget the American B-17 Flying Fortress contributed more toward victory than any other plane...

And, yes, they were Zeros that attacked Pearl Harbor. The carrier runways were too short for their bombers to take off of.

They didn't have missles either, and the weoponary they did have wasn't "ahead" of their time. They used standard bombs and torpedos (the only thing special about them was they had wooden fins instead of the traditional metal ones on the torpedos so they could fire in shallow water - I wouldnt really call using wood instead of metal "way out of its time")
 

ORC-r0x0r-ROC

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Yes they did use zeros i have now found that on a website that KNOWS what there talking about(i didnt know this before so i wasnt calling zeros outdated), thx guru for making me look it up (took me 3 hours lol) again i have found lots of things since i made this thread, cheers guys. Now ill move on they didnt only use zeros they used bombers and topedo bombers... like the d34. The missle thing was off a VERY inaccurate website. I know you should of noticed ive tried to change the subject of this thread... i would like to argue this america made most inventions thing, as they invented no where near as much things as MANY other countries
 

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within its 227 years as a nation, America has made the most inventions. The computer you are sitting at was an American invention. The lightbulb in your room is American made. Every flown in an airplane? An invention made by America. How about made a phone call? Ever watched a TV show or movie? Stopped at a traffic light? - all product of American inventors.
 

ORC-r0x0r-ROC

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"The lightbulb in your room is American made" <- first posted by guru

The history of the light bulb reads like a story straight out of a tabloid magazine. Contrary to what schools have taught for years, the American icon, Thomas Edison, neither invented the light bulb, nor held the first patent to the modern design of the light bulb.

Apparently, the we gave the esteemed Mr. Edison credit for the invention solely because he owned a power company, later known as General Electric, and a light bulb is just a bulb without a source of electricity to light it. In reality, light bulbs used as electric lights existed 50 years prior to Thomas Edison's 1879 patent date in the U.S.

Additionally, Joseph Swan, a British inventor, obtained the first patent for the same light bulb in Britain one year prior to Edison's patent date. Swan even publicly unveiled his carbon filament light bulb in New Castle, England a minimum of 10 years before Edison shocked the world with the announcement that he invented the first light bulb. Edison's light bulb, in fact, was a carbon copy of Swan's light bulb.

How do two inventors, from two different countries the invent exact same thing? Very easily, if one follows in the others footsteps. Swan's initial findings from tinkering with carbon filament electric lighting, and his preliminary designs, appeared in an article published by Scientific American. Without a doubt, Edison had access to, and eagerly read this article. Giving Mr. Edison the benefit of the doubt, and stopping short of calling him a plagiarist, we can say that he invented the light bulb by making vast improvements to Swan's published, yet unperfected designs.

Swan, however, felt quite differently, as he watched Edison line his pockets with money made from his invention, and took Edison to Court for patent infringement. The British Courts stood by their patent award for the light bulb to Swan, and Edison lost the suit. The British Courts forced Edison, as part of the settlement, to name Swan a partner in his British electric company. Eventually, Edison managed to acquire all of Swans' interest in the newly renamed Edison and Swan United Electric Company.

Edison fared no better back home in the U.S., where the U.S. Patent Office already ruled, on October 8, 1883, that Edison's patents were invalid, because he based them upon the earlier art of a gentleman named William Sawyer. To make matters worse, Swan sold his U.S. patent rights, in June 1882, to Brush Electric Company. This chain of events stripped Edison of all patent rights to the light bulb, and left him with no hope of purchasing any. I wonder what else edison swiped from us... by saying during Us history you are completely ignoring any invention made before then and america didnt start off from scratch....
 

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Firstly, don't copy and paste from websites unless you quote it. Its playjorism.

And excuse me, Edison didn't invent the lightbulb (neither did swan), he just made it drastically better. Edison made a praticaly lightbulb, that was 82% more efficeint, and burned 100 hours.

Also, I like how you could only reply to one brief part of a sentance of the entire post. Besides, we invented electricty, that counts for even more than the lightbulb
 

ORC-r0x0r-ROC

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wow your a dumass, electricity wasnt invented it was discovered, genius "The first scientific study of electricity did not appear until 1600, when William Gilbert published research that used the word "electric" to mean what happens when things are rubbed together. The first machine that made electricity was explained by Otto van Guericke in 1672. Benjamin Franklin also did experiments with kites and lightening to study electricity in the air. (Microsoft Encarta)"AND he was english.... yes good point.... Otto wasnt american either he was a german.
 

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Your the dumbass if you feel the need to comment on such a small thing. Discovered, invented, you get the picture.

Benjiman Franklin was an American citizen, making him American.

Electricity comes from lots of things that are not mechanical (take static electricity for example), the fact that Otto made a machine that produced it doesn't mean he discovered it.
 

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Originally posted by Guru
Your the dumbass if you feel the need to comment on such a small thing. Discovered, invented, you get the picture.

Benjiman Franklin was an American citizen, making him American.

Electricity comes from lots of things that are not mechanical (take static electricity for example), the fact that Otto made a machine that produced it doesn't mean he discovered it.
I never said franklin wasnt a american i said William Gilbert was english and he came a lot closer than franklin to inventing it. Also many people who helped him were british heres a quote from a site "
In 1743, in Boston, Benjamin Franklin was present at some electric experiments by Adam Spencer, a famous scottish professor.
Soon afterwards he asked his corrispondent from London, the naturalist Peter Collinson, to ship some glass tubes and set up a laboratory in his house.
In June 1752 B. Franklin made his famous experiment with a kite in which he proved that lightning was an electrical discharge from the clouds. " http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Circuit/1858 Face it there were people before and after him you cant honestly say he solely discovered it. It was "discovered" way before american history.
 

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Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
Face it there were people before and after him you cant honestly say he solely discovered it.
Who cares if there were people after him? 0_o
 
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