...and I Return a Man

[TrongaMonga]

This is of course a biast oppinion, but this country was founded on believing in something so strongly they gave up everything as well as felt strong enough to die for it.

All countries are founded that way, mate. It's called gaining independence

War has been part of human nature for too long. I'm only saying it's time to let it go. It's no longer needed as a first option. Only as a last resort option would you use the conventional army. The ultimate last resort would be the Nukes, but that's a different story.

And this isn't police work because, as they say, people keep dying for one reason or another. Police doesn't kill, they arrest and bring them to justice.

There is no time for justice in a war, so it can't be a police work.

 

[DB]

Don't let the media fool you, it is WAR.

... Actually it's the other way around, they're calling it the "War on Terror." However, it's still not a war.

 

[Pale_Horse]

... Actually it's the other way around, they're calling it the "War on Terror." However, it's still not a war.

Then why don't you classify to us all what a war is in your terms. Because it sure felt like one to me.

 

[DB]

Then why don't you classify to us all what a war is in your terms. Because it sure felt like one to me.

There was no formal declaration of war by Congress.

 

[Pale_Horse]

There was no formal declaration of war by Congress.

Hahaha .... oh this one you gotta proove. Because I know for a fact, I did not go over to Iraq for a ****ing year and a half vacation. No vaction I ever heard of involved me shooting a kid, watching someone take a bullet for me, having some kid fresh out of highschool die in lap, because he was missing everything from the waiste down.

Now do I beleive in war? No. I do however beleive that sometimes, it is needed, but only as a last resort. Do I think we should be finding and battling Bin Laden and his assholes, or doing something about Korea? Damn right, but that is not my call. I follow orders, and put my life on the line if need be, to make sure little shits like you who have no clue what they are talking about have the right to say such things.

Untill you have seen war, do not assume that it is not real, or happening. I do however agree, that this "war on Terrorism" is a farse. It is over oil and whatnot, but never the less people are still dying over there, because they believe in something.
I can almost garentee that on 9/11 you were mad as **** at what happened. The need to do something like that is beyond me. All I know, is THAT IN ITSELF WAS A DECLARATION OF WAR ON THE VERY WAY OF LIFE!
If you did not feel sad and angry on that day, I hope you suffer in life in everything that is to come.

And once again ... what is your classification of war? Look the shit up in a dictionary for all I care. Find out what it is and tell me that is not what is going on over there.

 

[DB]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declar...ited_States#Current_status_of_the_U.S._debate

 

[Pale_Horse]

That is because, to delair war you need to declare it on a nation. Since terrorism is not subject to a nation(s) their can truely be no said beginning to war. That is just legal bull that needed to be sided in order to fight back against terrorism. In no way shape or form does that mean the war is not real or is it not happening.

Not to mention that when the U.S. dropped the bomb to signafy our involvement to WWII, their was no papers saying we were going to war till a short time after the planes took off. That was done by a national address, much like it was with the beginning of this war.

Now quit dodging the question. What is your classification of a war? Because I garentee you it will fit what is going on right now over in iraq.

 

[DB]

"A declaration of war by the United States is the statement of purpose traditionally requested by the President of the United States and granted by Congress to engage military force against another nation."




I need the declaration to consider it a war. What's happening in Iraq does come quite close to a war, however it's missing the declaration.

 

[Pale_Horse]

"A declaration of war by the United States is the statement of purpose traditionally requested by the President of the United States and granted by Congress to engage military force against another nation."
I need the declaration to consider it a war. What's happening in Iraq does come quite close to a war, however it's missing the declaration.

Why don't you go over and sign up then. I'm sure if it is somewhat close to a war you have nothing to worry about then do you? Untill then, don't even talk about it, because you have no basis on what is going on around you.

 

[PauseBreak]

I need the declaration to consider it a war. What's happening in Iraq does come quite close to a war, however it's missing the declaration.

We've been in a war a rather long time now. But only now we have decided to go after it after another bombing of the world trade center. You do know that its bombed a couple times. Good. They waged war on us, they are still waging war on us thus we are fighting back making it a mutual agreeance of war.
A lot of people believe we are fighting Iraq, and not terrorism. Last time I checked if we were fighting Iraq we would not be helping set up a government in the eyes of Islam, we would not be re-building Iraq, nor would we be training and helping set up a police force of Iraqis in Iraq. In fact, it looks like we are helping them keep terrorists out of their country.
We are trying to find these terrorists around the world, the only problem is that these cowards, well lol, keep running away!

XxSworn_EnemyxX, thank you. Following orders is whats it is about.

And any of the the damn little kids who don't like whats going on, get elected and try to change it! Seriously, don't sit there and bitch about it, I dare you to move. Get up, fight for what you believe is right. If you want the troops removed from the world, get into politics. Don't sit there and smoke dope thinking you know it all. Do something about it.

 

[DB]

Why don't you go over and sign up then. I'm sure if it is somewhat close to a war you have nothing to worry about then do you? Untill then, don't even talk about it, because you have no basis on what is going on around you.

I can't sign up. My cousin is a 2nd Lt. in the Marine Corps, and he also doesn't think that it's a war.

 

[Tipsy]

Let me first say congratulations and that I have the utmost respect for those serving in our armed forces and serving our great nation.

That being said, the main reason I posted was to comment on something I hear a lot.

I can almost garentee that on 9/11 you were mad as **** at what happened. The need to do something like that is beyond me. All I know, is THAT IN ITSELF WAS A DECLARATION OF WAR ON THE VERY WAY OF LIFE!
If you did not feel sad and angry on that day, I hope you suffer in life in everything that is to come.

I'm not picking on you saying it specifically, it is just you have said it the clearest in this thread.

I really have to disagree with you here. Granted, yes I was swept up in the rise of patriotism, I was saddened at the loss of life, and I spent the better part of that week in front of the television watching the news, but I must say 9/11 was not the figurative Declaration of War that is portrayed in the media. 9/11 was retaliation, not the start.

We started this war quite a while ago, it is just we (generalization of Americans which does not fit all, but many) just ignored it or didn’t care because something like 9/11 had never happened. The fact is, we’ve used the Middle East as a sandbox for the last couple of decades. We have exploited them for their resources with very little or no care about what would happen to them, just our interests.

I am not saying we deserved it, mostly because there is no situation when I would ever deem it appropriate to kill civilians in any war, but that we should have seen it coming and that 9/11 was what brought our attention to this figurative war, not what started it.

 

[Гражданин СССР]

We've been in a war a rather long time now. But only now we have decided to go after it after another bombing of the world trade center. You do know that its bombed a couple times. Good. They waged war on us, they are still waging war on us thus we are fighting back making it a mutual agreeance of war.
A lot of people believe we are fighting Iraq, and not terrorism. Last time I checked if we were fighting Iraq we would not be helping set up a government in the eyes of Islam, we would not be re-building Iraq, nor would we be training and helping set up a police force of Iraqis in Iraq. In fact, it looks like we are helping them keep terrorists out of their country.
We are trying to find these terrorists around the world, the only problem is that these cowards, well lol, keep running away!

XxSworn_EnemyxX, thank you. Following orders is whats it is about.

And any of the the damn little kids who don't like whats going on, get elected and try to change it! Seriously, don't sit there and bitch about it, I dare you to move. Get up, fight for what you believe is right. If you want the troops removed from the world, get into politics. Don't sit there and smoke dope thinking you know it all. Do something about it.

Haha, yeah right. Its seems very funny to me how all Bush supporters miss the point, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 and Iraq does not have WMDs, attacking Iraq was simply something for Bush to do cause he was loosing popularity after ****ing up the economy, sadly it worked and the monkey man got reelected, says a lot about the American people.

The only thing Iraq war did was destabilize an already unstable region and give a reason for 10s of thousands of young Muslims to join the Jihad.

 

[TheJanitor]

America doesn't need to sign a piece of paper for something to be a war.

He lost a lot of votes over Iraq. He used the tax break and fake christian values to get relected.

 

[TrongaMonga]

Why not removing money, as well? It would end lots of problems. But it's inherent to the human race. The only way to finish Humanity's problems is by terminating it.

 

[Arkillo]

What the **** is this, Arcane Sanctury?

 

[Emperor Pan I]

A lot of people believe we are fighting Iraq, and not terrorism. Last time I checked if we were fighting Iraq we would not be helping set up a government in the eyes of Islam, we would not be re-building Iraq, nor would we be training and helping set up a police force of Iraqis in Iraq. In fact, it looks like we are helping them keep terrorists out of their country.

You are fighting Iraw, or at least much of the people you didn't kill. Where do you think terrorists come from? They come from the country you have bombed repeatedly(killing thousands), then try to rebuild in your image.

We are trying to find these terrorists around the world, the only problem is that these cowards, well lol, keep running away!

Is it cowardice, or strategy to avoid the most advanced military in the world? the fact it's basicly the best trained soldires with the best weapons against an average man with an AK-47 and maybe a low end bomb attached to him?

 

[Гражданин СССР]

America doesn't need to sign a piece of paper for something to be a war.

He lost a lot of votes over Iraq. He used the tax break and fake christian values to get relected.

Oh please, we both know that the war has kept him on the chair.

 

[Pale_Horse]

I can't sign up. My cousin is a 2nd Lt. in the Marine Corps, and he also doesn't think that it's a war.

That shit only counts if you are direct relation like brother, father, mother, sister, so don't give me that shit. The only thing that is for is to ensure the bloodline and name of a family. Do something for or against it, or shut the hell up.

Haha, yeah right. Its seems very funny to me how all Bush supporters miss the point, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 and Iraq does not have WMDs, attacking Iraq was simply something for Bush to do cause he was loosing popularity after ****ing up the economy, sadly it worked and the monkey man got reelected, says a lot about the American people.

The only thing Iraq war did was destabilize an already unstable region and give a reason for 10s of thousands of young Muslims to join the Jihad.

I am far from a Bush supporter, I am however a supporter of my way of life and believe in standing my ground to make sure it is known.

Tipsy, once again, (damn you and your fine tune sight) I guess I must clarify myself a bit. Yes 9/11 was the major catalyst to our present situation. I am aware, that U.S.S. Cole was in fact bombed by his loyal mindless. Let me corect myself and agree that 9/11 was NOT the beginning (my apologies) As you stated, we used the middle east, but, we have done this with just about every war ever fought, needless to say almost every major army has done this since its conception. All of the major powers at one time or another have inforced power by making the woman impregnated with the invading army, to making a religion the normal standard and ostrasising anyone who did not follow, ect. That is nothing new. It is just in modern times we have turned to companies, and political gain to put a foothold into a new budding nation.

 

[DB]

That shit only counts if you are direct relation like brother, father, mother, sister, so don't give me that shit. The only thing that is for is to ensure the bloodline and name of a family. Do something for or against it, or shut the hell up..

So, you're saying that my facts are bullshit because he's not in a direct relation with me? Also, you're a moron, I don't care what you say anymore.