Nerf Mana Burn !

[TheoStormhawk]

I play Warcraft TFT on Northrend and I want to state that I really hate DH's mana burn.
This spell has to be nerfed. It is not acceptable for a hero like DH to be able to take the mana from multiple heros in a game, not to mention that he is a pretty powerfull hero.
For example I was playing a game yesterday and I had Dark ranger (lvl 3) and panda (lvl 1). He mana burned them both and my heroes turned into stupid units.
This spell should cost more mana or take less or something..... The DH can mana burn a hero than start his immolation and pwn all the melee attackers.
THIS HERO IS A KILLER FOR THE ORC RACE which can't take him not even with blademaster.
Actually, the blademaster is the only hero in the game who can fight him.
With mana burn he can even leave without mana the intelligence heroes.
So, my vote is for the mana burn spell to be nerfed, or the mana cost or whatever. I really hate this hero, even if I am a random player, I hate him alot because warcraft is a spell game and he ruins the fun by turning the heroes in units.

[Chris]

Ok lets go back to 1.04 Wc3, where mana burn was 100/200/300. And look at it today. I would say that it being cut in half was a pretty good idea . However, the only time 50/100/150 is a lot, is when you use a hero that has no real mana pool like a TC or Pit Lord.

[Ntrik_]

LOL kid more pleease

NERF UD NUKES!

[Chris]

Yes, Frost Nova, Coil and Impale was always a devastating combo.

[Lizardbreath]

I haven't played warcraft 3 in a while but I can tell you that it is not all that hard to avoid mana burn and it is not overpowered. Just keep your hero in the back and range the **** out of the DH and cast spells on him.

[Jenny]

Originally Posted by Lizardbreath

I haven't played warcraft 3 in a while but I can tell you that it is not all that hard to avoid mana burn and it is not overpowered. Just keep your hero in the back and range the **** out of the DH and cast spells on him.

DH is melee and fast and sometimes people buy boots for him. Mana Burn is pretty much unavoidable seeing as how to be max distance you'd have to be outside of battles making you have no hero in battle just to avoid mana burn. Even then he can just chase you and theres nothing you can do.

Play the game first, maybe?

[Lizardbreath]

Of course, if you had realized that there would be UNITS in the way of you and the DH and you can surround him with your units and cast the **** out of him.

[Ntrik_]

Originally Posted by Lizardbreath

Of course, if you had realized that there would be UNITS in the way of you and the DH and you can surround him with your
units and cast the **** out of him.

Mana burn is hard to avoid, its got some range too u know (500? 400?)

eitherway, manaburn is not overpowered...

[Chris]

Mana Burn is an instant cast. The only way you can really stop it is if you have mana potions handy or sap his mana before he can cast it. Or block him from your hero.

[Lizardbreath]

I never use manaburn anyways when I was DH accept till later. I would usually just upgrade immolation/evasion and use him as a tank.

[Chris]

Yeah, but if you get hero harassed. Then mana burn is gonna save your hide.

[Lizardbreath]

That's if you choose manaburn as your first skill, which I don't.

[Chris]

Your skill would only serve some benefit if he brings units with him.

[Lizardbreath]

Well here's what I do when I start a game with the DH. Most of the time I creep/use wells and upgrade to my next skill (Evasion) and then if I have Exp to get to lvl 3 I might either choose immolation or mana burn. Typically, however, I choose immolation. It's a touch call but I use the immolation/focus fire and pick off the units and then I go for the hero.

[Impact02]

It's rarely used but if someone levels up mana burn and immo, that sucks, no mana for 1 of them, so I don't see a prob with that.

[Chris]

The only way you could support both things at once is if you carry Mana Potions.

[TheoStormhawk]

Originally Posted by Jenny

DH is melee and fast and sometimes people buy boots for him. Mana Burn is pretty much unavoidable seeing as how to be max distance you'd have to be outside of battles making you have no hero in battle just to avoid mana burn. Even then he can just chase you and theres nothing you can do.

Play the game first, maybe?

Nicely said and very true.

Anyway I wait with much interest for the next patch, something must be done, orc vs night elf is really painful to play. So much micro is required, so many healing salves, impossible expansion..............
There are alot of night elves on Northrend and alot of humans, I end up orc in the random choice kinda often against NE.

[Revelade]

Yea, he's right, back when DH was 100/200/300, he was godly. I think I had a 55-5 account back then using him.

But is he overpowered? I would say no. I've seen him die.

Imbalances? I'd say Pally against UD. It's ridiculous when he walks into base, lights the acolytes instantly and runs. Funny? Not when you're UD.

My hero hatred definitely has to go to the blademaster. No other hero pisses people off more. The way he can simply walk into your base and chop at your workers or buildings. Then he simply vanishes, forcing you to buy dust. Then you leave your base and he's back again. He buys potions to keep at it.

Nuke is also powerful. I've seen good players kill heroes in 1-2 seconds with it. Wow.

[Chris]

It's worse when the Paladin is LEvel 5. Since he can almost instant kill ghouls, instant kill acols, take away half the HP on a Fiend. He is the DK to the DK.

[TheoStormhawk]

Originally Posted by Revelade

Yea, he's right, back when DH was 100/200/300, he was godly. I think I had a 55-5 account back then using him.

But is he overpowered? I would say no. I've seen him die.

Imbalances? I'd say Pally against UD. It's ridiculous when he walks into base, lights the acolytes instantly and runs. Funny? Not when you're UD.

My hero hatred definitely has to go to the blademaster. No other hero pisses people off more. The way he can simply walk into your base and chop at your workers or buildings. Then he simply vanishes, forcing you to buy dust. Then you leave your base and he's back again. He buys potions to keep at it.

Nuke is also powerful. I've seen good players kill heroes in 1-2 seconds with it. Wow.

Originally Posted by Chris

It's worse when the Paladin is LEvel 5. Since he can almost instant kill ghouls, instant kill acols, take away half the HP on a Fiend. He is the DK to the DK.

Palladin imba huh? you guys are really funny
First of all for a palladin to get lvl 5 he needs to be first hero for the human. So u have DK and probably lich and the enemy has palladin. Just thinking of this array makes me laugh. Come on guys, u can even ignore him, and if you want to kill him get a dark ranger, silence and nuke him.
Palladin is porbably the best hero at level 10. But until you reach that level is pain, sacrifice and feeding micro and who ever will get a palladin at level 10 or at least 8? The same thing is with tauren chieftain, awesome late hero, at level 7 he becomes kinda imba. DH is imba because he is a killing machine since lvl 1 and his ulti makes him almost invincible.

Good heroes are not those heroes who can evade damage and kill peasants (like u say about palladin). DH for example can evade damage, can absorb lots of damage and most importantly can inflict enormous damage with emolation and disable your hero casting with mana burn.You hero has only 1 choice, to directly fight the DH. Well, as u know, the DH isn't exactly a weak hero. There is only 1 hero in the game who can really take him and that is BM, all the other heroes just tank against him. I've seen humans in replays with panda who got mana burned of 150 mana (panda than turned into an ordinary big ass unit with little attack damage and poor attack speed) and than emolation halfed their hp.
In my opinion blademaster should have had demon hunter's spells and viceversa, but that is just my opinion.

About your palladin again, I don't know how u people get scared by that hero, he as weak at first level as it is powerfull at late levels. I personally ignore that hero.

The reason of your concern is that the acolytes are precise targets for harrasers, not like the other worker units, but harass is early scout-attack stuff. If someone loses time later in the game to harass, especially with a hero like palladin, that harass could turn into a counter gg.
The best human asset remains AM, he has the best aura in the game, everyone cries for mana (even the undead with his statues) but not the human with AM who empowers his awesome casters and the MK or whatever other hero with good disablers. Also, the best non-ulti summoned unit which can be replaced by blizzard and the ulti that makes you all over the map WITH YOUR ARMY.

The other day I won a game against an orc in a orc vs orc game. The dude went grunts and raiders (more raiders than grunts) and I scouted him and didn't went raiders, I've build 2 bestiary but didn't went raiders (only in case I needed fast aa to train some bats), I made only grunts in about the same amount he had grunt and raiders. We saw each other in the midle of the map and engaged. I won because grunt beats the raider. After defeat he called me noob and stuff. The thing is that people watch pro replays and if they see some super pro guy always trains grunts and raiders means that grunts and raiders is what must be done always. But it isn't always so, those super pro guys train certain units because they know the game very well and can evaluate precisly unit types, strategies and prepare alot before for each game. The same thing is with palladin harassment; people see super pro people using MK and palladin to harass some undead expos (rarely main) and they try to do it too, though they don't really realise exactly what happens in those superplayer games.