The Help Thread 1.20

[QuikSilver]

GG mystic. Its good you kept pumping units out. Nice micro by both players. You didnt really masss casters that much but you went breakers. Ive never seen that been done before but it worked because of extra damage versus raiders and immune to magic(chainwave, shockwave). Doesnt it suck when you win versus some one like that but lose versus some noob?

Static, for first game.
The guy was a total noob. He didnt creep or do anything at the start. He really sucked. I dont know why you didnt beat him from the start. Also, ALWAYS check what his army is and is doing...throughout the game. I cant stress how important that is. I learnt it the hard way.

heh, ok, check out this game i played earlier versus orc. I win most of the time with this strat but this actual person held off. I had the win at the end but i made a stupid mistake not taking out his altar at the end. It is pretty long and we both do stupid mistakes. lol, dont think im noob when i lose all those foots and stuff...When i play versus orc and do this strat, i have to do this, it is part of the strat. Well, my gryph strat is still working. If you check out my quik.silver account...ull see im doing ok with it. 11-6....Most of my qwins are from orcs! heh...but i just got this last loss from this guy...im so pissed...

[Static]

I know the first game the dood was a noob. But He had a nice army for someone who doesn't creep.

At most times if I attacked my army would of been decimated, he wasn't going anywhere so I kept with the flurries for enough time to Get chims.

My second replay I was on the ball with most things, scoutting, abit of micro, creeping decently, and expos.

[None293823]

Static: Always use potions and u will see he will lose more from ff-ing your hero and not dying thx to potions. When ur hero is chased and u have full hp fiends no need to move them all but fight with them only your dk. And yes, 2nd game you should kick his ass once u have hunts and archers earleir.

Quik: Notice how you have 2 farms, 2 towers ,1 vault arround your alatar and lumber mill too. When your hero dies he will get blocked - waste of time, money (farm or lumber) and if he attacks you - your hero will die blocked. I have had THAT SORT of stupid losses. Dont repeat the same shit liek i have done, i think i dont now. Oh and you really blocked . Also de-control your injured (shift+select the injured). Orc was good he killed exactly your lowest hp griffs. In a replay 3wD.Mazk didnt make any bats but thats what they do vs griffs and no hawks (invis) even done by non-pro. Yeah so i dont use this, somehow the good aa he had and mass griffs lost thats a big loss and great exp for him. Only 1 hero ?
In my game, although i watch northrend players, i made this with breakers from azeroth player. Mass casters is good vs riders and grunts and shams and pults. (Breakers are also casters, so you can say mass casters). Except that they do extra dmg vs that ( i no longer use rifles because they would die and die and die and making again and again rifles- sucks) they are excellent for their feedback on TC. Breakers may need upgrade though. Armor is good and attack, you need scrolls of healing. They eventually are also all injured but mass heal would make them useful. Now what really sucks is a fast wind rider strat vs that - rapes casters strat. Thats why i build 1 aviary in case he makes that (i may even 2 aviaries). As i have caster strat and invis hawks i can kill his bats and i think with casters and some hawks above is best. Now if he goes taurens and bloodlust i have to make griffs somehow. (Usually happens on LT). And still the mass breakers can help you.

As you know, in Azeroth, you face fewer good players than in northrend in bnet and you are more likely to get more wins. 11:6 is very good. I am 17:16 which sucks but when i saw people 20:14 lvl 13 or 25:24 for a lvl 30 guy and pros: 17:7 i saw it wasnt only me. Everybody has lost to other pros and above 40 lvl. But i really have some stupid losses from noobs (~4 at least). And that really makes me ask - why the hell you play much fewer times on 100% of your skill ? When i played vs that orc i was very concentrated, i felt my head hot from thinking. Maybe i should be hot-head ? I will try this to make sure at least i lose not from too stupid newbs. Yes i still lost vs elf being concentrated before the game vs that orc.

[Emperor Pan I]

Could everyone do me a huge favor and not upload "lastrepaly" files please, for my sanity I cant download one without over riting another.

[None293823]

OMG Tell ME TIps Vs THAT I KNOw when the game became WHo will dwestroy buildings 1si i already lost. This is a ****ING 2nd TIME this happens - last time a noob UD with wyrms goes HERE AND THERE and kills mu BUILDINGS. I ****ING hate when the game becomes MAKE A FARM on ebery SPOT not to LOSE. OMG this is tje NOOBEST thing ever existing on this game. ANd this the 2nd ****ing tim it happens on the STUPID LT! LT where Human can expand , EVERYBODY can WIN with Build 10 buildings on 100000 spots. This is what sucks abput this map- the game is ****IN NOOB GAME when you have to race for last building stand. Pls tell me what i have to do not to allow to be played by going on 10 different spots and losing liek that. OMG now this is what happens ??WHY ? WHy you beat a 10xx better players and lose to a total noob who only wins with LAST BILDING STAND ????

Last time i lost in the same vs NOOB-WYRMS and SPIDERS-- same shit go East West North South Northeast northwestsoutheast sputhwest Up dpwn 90 degrees 120 degreeas ...

[Emperor Pan I]

Yo youre replay "OMG", here is what I think of your game.

00:00:00 to 00:03:57
Opening move you fast expand, on LT is is expected for a Human to do so. However the game is geared towards letting no advantage reign. When you fast expand, you leave yourself open, especialy to a BM harassing. I've capitalized on a Human fast expand before. Now by 04:57, you have 200 gold in your pocket, essentialy no base defence, three footmen and an AM. The problem with the fast expansion presents itself here. While i'm not condemning the strategy, it leaves you Very open, which the BM is very good at exploiting. Lets move on.

00:05:30
Now I'm an undead palyer, I've had more than my fair share of Orc techers. You can tell right off you weren't going to have a successful attack. At this point, Attacking isn't the smartest move right now. Not with 4 towers, A dk might take down one tower with healing fiends, but a human isn't getting past that.

00:06:55
Essentialy 3 minutes later you have the exact same problem as you did at 3:57, except now your AM is going to get chased down and killed, in the process wasting a TP. Now God knows I am not a human player, I would have personaly thrown up a tower or two at your main. I mean you have 1000 gold, and your peasents are getting wiped out, that is just more gold you have to shell out to rebuild them anyways. Also I would say a vauly might have helped, if not for a potion later on. It is unfortunate the Humans don't have a dust at thier shop, but the Goblin merchant does, and he is just outside your door. Lets move on.

00:12:00
Didn't know that having 7 peasents on a mine made anything mine faster? Just thought I would point that out. Also a little earlier your expansion was getting rocked by the BM. Now I would suggest maybe researching the magic sentry. It's only 50/50, and you can spot the damn BM, very good especialy if u have it at your main, so if it does run to harass when you have it, he won't be happy.

00:16:17
Was it really necissary to blow a TP at this point to get to your expansion that was a few feet away. A tp costs 350, not to be taken lightly.

00:20:00
Orange was creeping, he left his base, legs spread ready for you to rape it. you had morters, and with the positions of towers you could have done some destruction.

00:21:00
Nothing you could do, you have a strategy he countered it, you counter back. Bats>Grphs. Only problem is when you get D-hawks, you don't really use them against his bats. mnore later

00:21:36
That poor paladin. Dunno why, but the Paladin was slow to respond. Maybe a quicker reaction, because a paladin that gets broguht to red right before a battle is not cool.

00:22:00
Bad positioning. Personaly sitting on the bottom of a slope is a bad idea. Units on the bottom have a higher percentage chance to miss, plus he sees you far longer then you see him. Coming down the middle he serperates you from a few sorc, also not very good. Bad positioning, and he has an advantage to where you tP.

00:27:00
BATTLE! The probme is your grphons are just floating there invisible. No bats around to harm them, they arn't of much use. And they would have helped. Second hero for second hero. You foucs on the TC, while your MK dies, and in turn the TC dies. this migth sound fairly even but it's not. The BM has spent the entire game ahead in exp points. It's a level 6 BM with taurens vs. a level 4 AM with gryph/DH. Now it seems pretty obvious, since the Taurens cant attack air it seems likely who would win. However you focus on the BM. Now if there is one thing this game should have taught us all by now is a BM can become invisible, and is almsot impossible to kill. You don't have a MK arround for bolt, nor can you see invisible units. Sure enough your flying units focus on the hero, and he gets away. Valuable time wasted. It happens with Demon hunters and wardens. If a hero 90% of the time gets away, don't bother focusing if you can kill his units. Because later on the Taurens are the reason your base is completely destroyed. Also 3 bats get in there while your focusing. one while you focuse on his BM, and two while you focus on his idle Beastiery. I know no one has teh fastest reaction time in the world, but saving your Gryhpons would have been nice for later in the game.

00:29:00
Ok, you have one expansion, the entire map is open, your main has exhausted it's gold, and you have like 9 peasents on one mine. A second expansion, even by side his old base would have definately helped with the gold situation in aiding your game. Instead your exp gets wiped out. Not fun to watch a few times.

00:33:00
I noticed that you did not scout his second base, and he runs taurens up to kill your only base. Not cool

by 35:00 on it's pretty much a down hill slide.

[Static]

Originally Posted by Pan

Yo youre replay "OMG", here is what I think of your game.

00:00:00 to 00:03:57
Opening move you fast expand, on LT is is expected for a Human to do so. However the game is geared towards letting no advantage reign. When you fast expand, you leave yourself open, especialy to a BM harassing. I've capitalized on a Human fast expand before. Now by 04:57, you have 200 gold in your pocket, essentialy no base defence, three footmen and an AM. The problem with the fast expansion presents itself here. While i'm not condemning the strategy, it leaves you Very open, which the BM is very good at exploiting. Lets move on.

00:05:30
Now I'm an undead palyer, I've had more than my fair share of Orc techers. You can tell right off you weren't going to have a successful attack. At this point, Attacking isn't the smartest move right now. Not with 4 towers, A dk might take down one tower with healing fiends, but a human isn't getting past that.

00:06:55
Essentialy 3 minutes later you have the exact same problem as you did at 3:57, except now your AM is going to get chased down and killed, in the process wasting a TP. Now God knows I am not a human player, I would have personaly thrown up a tower or two at your main. I mean you have 1000 gold, and your peasents are getting wiped out, that is just more gold you have to shell out to rebuild them anyways. Also I would say a vauly might have helped, if not for a potion later on. It is unfortunate the Humans don't have a dust at thier shop, but the Goblin merchant does, and he is just outside your door. Lets move on.

00:12:00
Didn't know that having 7 peasents on a mine made anything mine faster? Just thought I would point that out. Also a little earlier your expansion was getting rocked by the BM. Now I would suggest maybe researching the magic sentry. It's only 50/50, and you can spot the damn BM, very good especialy if u have it at your main, so if it does run to harass when you have it, he won't be happy.

00:16:17
Was it really necissary to blow a TP at this point to get to your expansion that was a few feet away. A tp costs 350, not to be taken lightly.

00:20:00
Orange was creeping, he left his base, legs spread ready for you to rape it. you had morters, and with the positions of towers you could have done some destruction.

00:21:00
Nothing you could do, you have a strategy he countered it, you counter back. Bats>Grphs. Only problem is when you get D-hawks, you don't really use them against his bats. mnore later

00:21:36
That poor paladin. Dunno why, but the Paladin was slow to respond. Maybe a quicker reaction, because a paladin that gets broguht to red right before a battle is not cool.

00:22:00
Bad positioning. Personaly sitting on the bottom of a slope is a bad idea. Units on the bottom have a higher percentage chance to miss, plus he sees you far longer then you see him. Coming down the middle he serperates you from a few sorc, also not very good. Bad positioning, and he has an advantage to where you tP.

00:27:00
BATTLE! The probme is your grphons are just floating there invisible. No bats around to harm them, they arn't of much use. And they would have helped. Second hero for second hero. You foucs on the TC, while your MK dies, and in turn the TC dies. this migth sound fairly even but it's not. The BM has spent the entire game ahead in exp points. It's a level 6 BM with taurens vs. a level 4 AM with gryph/DH. Now it seems pretty obvious, since the Taurens cant attack air it seems likely who would win. However you focus on the BM. Now if there is one thing this game should have taught us all by now is a BM can become invisible, and is almsot impossible to kill. You don't have a MK arround for bolt, nor can you see invisible units. Sure enough your flying units focus on the hero, and he gets away. Valuable time wasted. It happens with Demon hunters and wardens. If a hero 90% of the time gets away, don't bother focusing if you can kill his units. Because later on the Taurens are the reason your base is completely destroyed. Also 3 bats get in there while your focusing. one while you focuse on his BM, and two while you focus on his idle Beastiery. I know no one has teh fastest reaction time in the world, but saving your Gryhpons would have been nice for later in the game.

00:29:00
Ok, you have one expansion, the entire map is open, your main has exhausted it's gold, and you have like 9 peasents on one mine. A second expansion, even by side his old base would have definately helped with the gold situation in aiding your game. Instead your exp gets wiped out. Not fun to watch a few times.

00:33:00
I noticed that you did not scout his second base, and he runs taurens up to kill your only base. Not cool

by 35:00 on it's pretty much a down hill slide.

You gotta hit me up with one of those.

[QuikSilver]

OK pan, You dont have to actrually save the replay in your folder...you can just watch it by double clicking on it or by right clicking and pressing open with....

Mystic omfg what a game. There was a point in the game where, you should have sent the gryphs over to his towers/burrows....You would have raped him before he could have gotten the bats.

make a second expansion way earlier... AND MAKE A DARN ARCANE TOWER next to your peasants in your main base...It will repel him like a bitch...GG man...

[Emperor Pan I]

Originally Posted by quiksilver87

OK pan, You dont have to actrually save the replay in your folder...you can just watch it by double clicking on it or by right clicking and pressing open with....

If I have Warcraft III open, I have to close it for it to work. then have to reclose it and do that to open it agiain. I prefer to save it directly to the same place every time.

[Chris]

See how I feel. I have to reinstall the game because its not picking up my replay folder. It won't save or let me view replays.

[Emperor Pan I]

Originally Posted by Hellwolf_36

See how I feel. I have to reinstall the game because its not picking up my replay folder. It won't save or let me view replays.

Have you modified it in any way?

[QuikSilver]

hey this is my last replay...I really dont know how to beat this strat for NE.....

[None293823]

In the beginning, trying to harass with AM only i dont think the idea was good. Creeping would be better. (At that time you didnt have enough units to kill him) .

~00:09:30
You didnt have enough rifles but at least you didnt lose any of them. Creeping would be still better. You see mass hunts, obviously he wont make smth unexpected at that time (in case you did it for scouting).

00:12:30-00:12:33
I think you could wait for the coming sorc before attacking.

00:15:05
Your AM shouldnt flow like that away from the army. I have done this mistake too. One surround and you know what happens. It sucks if you separate your army with the tp.

00:16:00+
Same thing, you move your hero alone right in his army. Also move a little with your army in your base and start shooting, dont move left and right so continuously. Morts would be useful but you didnt have any. I use blizzard when im only lvl 3 and he has bears and you needed blizz too.

00:21:49
In his 2nd expand and before that... yeah you kill what you can and quickly tp. NOTE: Sometimes he may tp behind and all units on 1place. A blizz would kick him seriously.

00:26 to 27:00
Yeah i think he had already taken the advantage. And i have 1 question here , Pan can answer too. When the DH lvl 5 had ankh shouldnt you attack the army not ff on DH? I think you should attack army because a resurrection will cost him 1 life (as if you didnt attack anybody-he is still alive) and 0 units lost, while you keep losing army.


And ?= he doesnt want to tell you. No need to ask for suggestions an oppo - it may be of advanage of him not to tell you.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
MY REPLAY
Thx Pan for making that kind of tips with time for me too

I agree with quik that vs BM i should have a tower in my base even arcane. In my expand i would leave 1 tower aracane and 1 guard but no need to make 3++ towers. As you can see in your replay his army cuts even 4 towers like cheese.

00:05:30
As you can see Pan, i didnt lose a unit. I did it like quiksilver , same mistake but not AM alone- It was for scouting. And i had to simply use militia i guess.

Towering- you need only 1 tower (in your base), Pan i am saying this as a hu player - and should it be arcane -ok. Massing towers like some... you see a good player can take towers down. It cant make you win if not vs noob only you can hold your loss for later. And i agree with you, 1 racane tower- thats it. Then surround the stupid bm. Yes dust, i should have used it but u see what im talking when dust is needed for hu but Blizzard didn ntohing about it.

And that sukcs - massing towers to tech.... a typical chinese/korean lamers strat. ANd his name is also like chinse/korean lamer. 12:00 I didnt put 7 works because i dont know, i selected them and was busy with other things than that. Yeah i should use sentry too.

00:16:17
i should think that i may need these 350 gold later when i dont have gold. OMG i tp-ed for that distance kick me.

20:00
I stopped because i wanted to look for exp- also big mistake since i am in his MAIN base and can scout for expand with militia. He killed 3 griffs - that was insane.

22:00 Yeah i know its bad but he was also not on the top of the hill (later when we started little fight before tp). Thats why i attacked. I had to tp- i would lose the same no matter where i tp no ?

27:00
Omg yes BIG mistakes. What i also said to quik with time waste on DH with ankh.

28:00

I will tell u smth you missed. Leaving 1 unit to see if he des smth from the base would be nice. I should have ATTACKED HIS TAURENS RUNNIN AWAY and KILL THEM.

29:
I should learn to make a 2nd EXAPND when MY MAIN base has no gold yes. And such long games make the game so nervous that i stop thinking well.



I should have saved my castle earlier, more important. And i couldnt find his expo at 3 o'clock for whole 7 mins!

Thanks Pan, i will use these tips as a learning book.


But there is something which quickly chnaged the thoughts about stupid loss. A lvl 30-35 orc didnt want to play me because when he saw my old stats 280:273 .. yeah i understand why. But doubting in my APM and skill .... I have played vs smbody lvl 25 on 350 wins or lvl 25 on 400-500 wins. Man it must be BNet AMM taht makes them have alsmot equal wins to losses and not fewer wins than losses. They were so newbs, and now the semi pro and pros think with such stats i am that short of shit. [b]It is time i found my place in a clan among good players. This caused a new apporach - no mor efear of stats on my real acca u know it. Only BNet and i will play some rules: 3 games on 3 differnet maps vs each semi pro, challenge by me. It's time to be in a good clan. I may leave a loss with a hanging tail yes, they are probably better but lets show them how i play and dont i really have skill (micro + strats) and high apm.

Edit: I will find another good solo clan and when they want to play me one day - i will ignore them.

[QuikSilver]

heh thx for the tips. I dont think you noticed but there was a point EARLY IN THE GAME when i had 2000 gold...I should have been building units and pushing the attack...but i didnt because im noob like that.
About the ankh...I didnt really check the hero. I usually dont, because i forget...But i know i should....bah, i would have lost that battle either way. those bears are invincible. I should have went with clap and blizzard but it didnt occur to me....

About your replay mystic...Ill watch it as soon as i get home and give you a good report...

[None293823]

Last time on the ESL when I watched how Insomnia won vs NE (Just.Diesel, mTw-DIDI8, OMA.S.Jack, Xoz_Magadansky) , i.e watched over 10 wins vs elf, i statred playing like crazy the next games vs elf (1st days after i had watched them).

Now the same thing is his victory in Greece , this time vs mass UD players. What's more, not the mass hawks strategy but rifles and casters + castle. Same thing vs this UD harasser (mass ghouls + DK, lich + i didnt allow him to make dests) whose ass i totally kicked . And in the end i got disc-ed (when winning). Anyway due to my gameplay.

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Pan

Have you modified it in any way?

I deleted my old replays that were back in like 1.18 and shit.

[None293823]

Here's a better GG ud with insomnia strat - rilfes abd casters, 3 heroes and blizzard after retraining.

I might post a loss vs orc but to tell you XYUove i can see the reasons of my losses myself except for ''destroy the last building lame game'' . And Hellwolf pls go to some old threads and remove my old attachments from day to day, that 'ard Roach of discored - THE ADMIN! does nothing.

[Chris]

The heck, I just cleaned you space like 3 weeks ago, oh well.

[QuikSilver]

lol....yeah mystic like to post replays.

Hey about this game. UD didnt play well at all. I gues he was a NE player from his nick. You upgraded to tier 2 wayy to early...if the UD player was any good he would have massed ghouls ftw. But he lost them all...Ud player had no micro and should have expanded...

[None293823]

Noob game yes. I should have a site to post some reps but when my quota becomes full thx to Mr Admin doing nothing who is far worse than the other admins in the past i will stop posting at all. Besides this game, im currently equaling my stats because i made over 15 losses from disconnections or crashes, i also had over 6 losses more. And im really going to start new acca and play with the new and the old one together as soon as i make 350 wins on the old, 29 wins left.