DOTA: Heroes and Core Items.

[electricmole]

Originally Posted by Jenny

I usually have no problem going without BKB on Lesh, but if you're in a game with a lot of stun and/or disrupt then it's a must have. Otherwise you'll never get close enough to make good use of your ulti and the other short aoe range move. You'll be a two trick pony with earthquake and lightning and then you'll be fodder.

Personally I think bloodstone sucks. I'd rather put the soul booster into a scepter. I mean, I guess it's an adequate item to have until you can afford the mystic staff, then you break up the bloodstone and build that. This is the only time I ever get it.

sometimes its better for your teammate to do a specific task while keeping yours as well. so when using leshrac and there are tons of enemies with disable, well let your team get stun first,, they know that you will come afterwards and help them by massing your skill. its not like you are the one they will try to mass stun first, well you may have a tanker or damage dealer in your team that are the ones priritarize to be stun by the enemy.

never in my entire dota life i would buy leshrac a bkb. scpeter/linken/travel/heart/guinsoo/ is more than enough.

likewise if i get a soul booster i usually try hard to get next the staff and avoid getting a perseverance all the time. maybe after the scpeter i can just go for the bloodstone.

[Ntrik_]

ofc bkb isnt useful when your enemies are all agi dps... hell u dont even need bkb in pub games most of the time cuz newbs there always pick agi carries.

And as for blood stone... it sucks when you got no charges on it, but once the charges for the blood stone goes past 6 then its gg.

The reason i'd get bloodstone before sceptor, is that you'll be lacking regen overall if you go sceptor right away for anything. But if you go bloodstone early and grab kills here and there, u'll have several charges on it in no time, and if you do happen to die, you'd be losing less gold + less time wasted over death.

That being said, it all doesnt matter in -em since you can farm any items instantly lawl

[Jenny]

I don't go scepter right away. I get sobi mask/ring bas and then build up a pers. Get my boots and maybe a bracer and null then work on Aghanims. Sobi and Void is all you need to spam lightning bolt. Then I break my bloodstone up, make aghanims and break my pers and make guinsoo and maybe vanguard pending how many carry heroes they have. If they have alot of nuke/stun I get BKB above all else, like I do for Maiden and Witchdoctor.

[electricmole]

im not the typical player who still goes for nulls/sobimask/ etc if they are not part of my core item. i usually go for point booster for leshrac first or if im farming good earlier on i go straight for the ultimate orb(one of my fave basic item in dota).

Originally Posted by Ntrik_

And as for blood stone... it sucks when you got no charges on it, but once the charges for the blood stone goes past 6 then its gg.

this may sound noob, but since i dont use bloodsotne im just not very familiar with it. i know it supposed to get you lesser cooldown time after death if you have the charges but past 6? 6 charges? what does it actually do? 6 instances of lesser death cooldown? does it lesser more time with exactly 6 charges?

[Jenny]

You rez quicker and you still gain xp in the area you die for an amount of time. Not sure if it reduces the amount of gold you lose or not. Mana regen is a must have for Lesh early on if you intend on harassing which you should since lightning bolt farms for you and can harass multiple heroes.

[BARNABY JONES]

Bloodstone adds what, like 500HP/Mana, HPregen and Manaregen, gives you sight of areas you die in, as well as XP for mobs/creeps/players killed there. It lowers the amount of time it takes you to respawn, and it lowers the amount of gold you lose when you die (but still gives the killer full amount). For something like 5k.

I used to get it all the time on heroes until I realized that it's not all that good unless it's one of the first items you go for. And if you do that, chances are you're going to gimp yourself unless you're a caster or something with a mana/hp as attack skill like Ursa or Harbinger.

Then again, I go stat/trueshot/stat/trueshot until 12 on Traxex (6 and 11 pump ult) so what do I know.

[Jenny]

Gross. Trueshot is worthless until you actually have damage to amplify. Cold arrow targeting lets you harass without drawing creeps onto you. It's also a free kill with boots early on. I can understand stats. Depending on who I'm laning against I go cold arrows and silence, but if there's not alot of nuke heaviness I go cold arrow, then silence, then cold arrow, followed by more stats. Trueshot arrow is most useful after you're lvl 8 or later. I can understand going without more than a point in silence early on, but skipping cold arrow is crazay.

[electricmole]

agree thats why linken sphere can be a core item for lesrac. bkb as your first or second item will not help you that much early on for obvious reason.

gain exp on the area you died? wow, neverr knew that but thats a great perk. i think i will really try bloodstone now. still waiting for the answer about the 6 charges tho.

heres my next hero and core item suggestion.

lina inverse. SCEPTER as usual and yes kellens dagger of escape. the new dagger now with the 3 seconds penalty is lessen the effectiveness of it for lina as a core item. anyway if your the killer and fast lina type of player dagger is still the way to go.

scepter with 1250 damage on laguna blade is godlike.

a very important combo tip on lina and honestly i did not copied this on anyone else since i know lina now than ever i discovered it while i was mastering her about 3-4 years ago. shes one of the first few heroes that i like in dota. she maybe is on the top 3 on my list in overall played heroes count.

the combo trick.

stun/laguna/dragon wave. yes laguna first before dragon wave. its effective specially against wind walkers. untill people would still use laguna as a last hit and it doesn't look cool on your teamate coz its like just getting a free kill.

blink/stun/laguna/wave a farming bone clinkz skeletal a**.

or blink/attack twice/laguna/wave.

or

blink/attack twice/ginsoo/attack twice/laguna/wave.

its all about fast micro.

[electricmole]

EDIT: omg. sorry for the duplicate post. my internet is lagging at the moment. but it be fine later so dont worry.


agree thats why linken sphere can be a core item for lesrac. bkb as your first or second item will not help you that much early on for obvious reason.

gain exp on the area you died? wow, neverr knew that but thats a great perk. i think i will really try bloodstone now. still waiting for the answer about the 6 charges tho.

heres my next hero and core item suggestion.

lina inverse. SCEPTER as usual and yes kellens dagger of escape. the new dagger now with the 3 seconds penalty is lessen the effectiveness of it for lina as a core item. anyway if your the killer and fast lina type of player dagger is still the way to go.

scepter with 1250 damage on laguna blade is godlike.

a very important combo tip on lina and honestly i did not copied this on anyone else since i know lina now than ever i discovered it while i was mastering her about 3-4 years ago. shes one of the first few heroes that i like in dota. she maybe is on the top 3 on my list in overall played heroes count.

the combo trick.

stun/laguna/dragon wave. yes laguna first before dragon wave. its effective specially against wind walkers. untill people would still use laguna as a last hit and it doesn't look cool on your teamate coz its like just getting a free kill.

blink/stun/laguna/wave a farming bone clinkz skeletal a**.

or blink/attack twice/laguna/wave.

or

blink/attack twice/ginsoo/attack twice/laguna/wave.

its all about fast micro.

[Jenny]

Originally Posted by electricmole

agree thats why linken sphere can be a core item for lesrac. bkb as your first or second item will not help you that much early on for obvious reason.

gain exp on the area you died? wow, neverr knew that but thats a great perk. i think i will really try bloodstone now. still waiting for the answer about the 6 charges tho.

heres my next hero and core item suggestion.

lina inverse. SCEPTER as usual and yes kellens dagger of escape. the new dagger now with the 3 seconds penalty is lessen the effectiveness of it for lina as a core item. anyway if your the killer and fast lina type of player dagger is still the way to go.

scepter with 1250 damage on laguna blade is godlike.

a very important combo tip on lina and honestly i did not copied this on anyone else since i know lina now than ever i discovered it while i was mastering her about 3-4 years ago. shes one of the first few heroes that i like in dota. she maybe is on the top 3 on my list in overall played heroes count.

the combo trick.

stun/laguna/dragon wave. yes laguna first before dragon wave. its effective specially against wind walkers. untill people would still use laguna as a last hit and it doesn't look cool on your teamate coz its like just getting a free kill.

blink/stun/laguna/wave a farming bone clinkz skeletal a**.

or blink/attack twice/laguna/wave.

or

blink/attack twice/ginsoo/attack twice/laguna/wave.

its all about fast micro.

Explain? I know Linken's gives you Mana regen, but it's also more expensive and provides less defense to spells. BKB is full immunity for most likely the entire duration of a battle. Aoe disable is popular in League and BKB can save you from this, linkens cannot. Linken's gives stats, sure, but Lesh isn't hurting in the mana department. He has one of if not the highest int base and growth. Agility doesn't matter at all, really, and you get less str from Linkens. BKB gives you plenty of strength, which is what you need, and full spell immunity. The only thing that you could argue is better on linkens is the stats when you can get for cheaper through bracers/null and the mana regen through a sobi and void (for future guinsoo).

If you're against a windwalker you can usually get a dragon wave off and laguna immediately if you're using hotkeys. Even so it's better to depend on windwalk cooldown over hoping wave finishes or coveres the aoe they're in.

You've also consider that it is a waste of Laguna if you fail to kill Clinkz. Laguna is better for situations where you know it'll kill or to weaken a carry in group situations, which in either case dragon slave is better before because it's range is shorter than Laguna, I believe.

[Ntrik_]

more charges on bloodstone = more health and mana regen.

and 500 hp/mana bonus.. is HUGE from a single item, and add giant health mana regen when u have over 10++ cahrges on it. You can basically turn on ult for the whole game without any mana reduction.. Ive seen a game where Lesh had his ult on and still had mana regenerating because of blood stone.

and yea.. thats exactly why i said get bloodstone first mike

and lol for traxex, i jus go cold arrow and trueshot and it all works out by lvl 11 lol. You can easily do 150~200 per hit when you get lothar tread and 3 bands on traxex. thats all she needs to own in really

[electricmole]

Originally Posted by Jenny

Explain? I know Linken's gives you Mana regen, but it's also more expensive and provides less defense to spells. BKB is full immunity for most likely the entire duration of a battle. Aoe disable is popular in League and BKB can save you from this, linkens cannot. Linken's gives stats, sure, but Lesh isn't hurting in the mana department. He has one of if not the highest int base and growth. Agility doesn't matter at all, really, and you get less str from Linkens. BKB gives you plenty of strength, which is what you need, and full spell immunity. The only thing that you could argue is better on linkens is the stats when you can get for cheaper through bracers/null and the mana regen through a sobi and void (for future guinsoo).

If you're against a windwalker you can usually get a dragon wave off and laguna immediately if you're using hotkeys. Even so it's better to depend on windwalk cooldown over hoping wave finishes or coveres the aoe they're in.

You've also consider that it is a waste of Laguna if you fail to kill Clinkz. Laguna is better for situations where you know it'll kill or to weaken a carry in group situations, which in either case dragon slave is better before because it's range is shorter than Laguna, I believe.

I don’t use linken mainly for the spell negation on hero like leshrac. The extra stat except for the agi and the usefull 100% mana regen and decent hp regen benefits a hero like lesharac whose mostly rely on spamming nukes also it makes you last longer and surviving battles. Actually leshrac quickly runs out of mana if you don’t have a decent mana pool and regen adding item while spamming his 4 spells. Linken sphere allows me to farm without actually going home all the time, you got hp regen and mana regen to spam and farm and kill for more. His int is high but so as his skill mana requirements, and nova is passive so you need mana regen and large mana pool to effectively use it.

How much does bkb give str to leshrac? I think its only 10 just like linken. Anyway you don’t really need str items for him if you can get a vit booster/point/ or simply a soulbooster.

In most games and against decent player, after you cast wave the wind walkers have the time to activate wind walk and by that time you can’t click but only the ground with your laguna.

I already killed a lot of wind walking heroes after they got laguna using dragon wave after. It happens very fast….really fast. You don’t bother where they will move after they wind walk… stun/laguna/wave happen very fast if you click fast. There is just less than a second time they can move during their wind walk escape plan so 100% they will still get hit by dragon wave.

I usually look at enemies hp before I go and hunt with lina. Even full hp agi or int heroes can be killed by the combo if they don’t got life items.

Clinks/Gondar/nerub/ etc… with no counter items dies easily with the blink/stun/laguna/wave combo. Its fun actually seeing them wind walk right away thinking they can get away but just by the time they can even move I dragon slave and kill them at the same spot.

Originally Posted by Ntrik_

more charges on bloodstone = more health and mana regen.

and 500 hp/mana bonus.. is HUGE from a single item, and add giant health mana regen when u have over 10++ cahrges on it. You can basically turn on ult for the whole game without any mana reduction.. Ive seen a game where Lesh had his ult on and still had mana regenerating because of blood stone.

and yea.. thats exactly why i said get bloodstone first mike

and lol for traxex, i jus go cold arrow and trueshot and it all works out by lvl 11 lol. You can easily do 150~200 per hit when you get lothar tread and 3 bands on traxex. thats all she needs to own in really

I thought charges are only for how many times you can use the lesser rest time. So it icreases hp/mana regen if you kill more heroes. Great, it is really a good item especially if you’re the killer type of using leshrac. I can’t wait to try it.

[Jenny]

I thought it only increased regeneration per charge and only like 1 hp per charge and 10% mana. Maybe not. Never cared to read the tooltip cause Aghanim's is just better.

BKB is better for negating spells. A few nulls/bracers is better for stats. You're spending way too much just for stats.

[electricmole]

Originally Posted by Jenny

I thought it only increased regeneration per charge and only like 1 hp per charge and 10% mana. Maybe not. Never cared to read the tooltip cause Aghanim's is just better.

BKB is better for negating spells. A few nulls/bracers is better for stats. You're spending way too much just for stats.

but with linken sphere you can save up more slots on your inventory for the boosters items and teleportation scroll, wards etc. 3 nulls would force you to buy a chicken.

and linken sphere is just a better investments than lvl basic items. on late games a linken sphere is more usefull than 3 nulls for sure.

linken got insane mana regen and decent hp regen where even 4 of those lvl 1 items can never have. and why buy 4 if you can buy just 1 saving more slots on your inventory and giving you more advantages as the games goes on.

with linken you dont need to go back to your base all the time because of the mana and hp regen and that alone makes this item more for its cost.

[BARNABY JONES]

Originally Posted by Jenny

Gross. Trueshot is worthless until you actually have damage to amplify. Cold arrow targeting lets you harass without drawing creeps onto you. It's also a free kill with boots early on. I can understand stats. Depending on who I'm laning against I go cold arrows and silence, but if there's not alot of nuke heaviness I go cold arrow, then silence, then cold arrow, followed by more stats. Trueshot arrow is most useful after you're lvl 8 or later. I can understand going without more than a point in silence early on, but skipping cold arrow is crazay.

Having 66base + 66dmg at lvl 7 is no way at all worthless. Yeah, you can't catch the heroes as fast at the start, but trusme it's ownage.

[BARNABY JONES]

And it's 1/hp 20%mana per charge on Bloodstone I though, so when it hits 6 it's 6hp/120% mana, which is just slightly above preservance levels.

I still think the item is one of those towards the end of the game things to get and only if you need the life boost. You're better off with something like Skadi, which is only about 1k more and much more benificial.

[electricmole]

imo skadi doesn't work great for leshrac, since you mainly focus on spamming your skills than doing normal attack.

wait a minute. about the bloodstone.

the bloodstone alone already got 100% mana regen from the void stone, right?

so when you accumulate 6 charges (120% mana regen).. so does the total become 220% mana regen? now thats a lot and leshrac would be owning with that.

[Jenny]

Skadi is the worst item in the game. It's immensely overpriced considering all you get is stats and a pitiful slow attack. It's extremely easy to out run the slow attack and it's really useless on most heroes. It's decent on someone like Sniper as a 2nd or 3rd 'big' item, but other then that it's a waste. I'd rather get a butterfly or BKB- even a Burize.

[electricmole]

^ the terror blade do well with skadi. lina inverse with ultimate on late games as well but not really necessary.

[Jenny]

Only time you'd ever have a chance to get Skadi on Slayer is in a 60+ min -em game. Plus you gotta get your survival and cake items. Dagger, boots of travels, and scepter.

As for Terrorblade absolutely not. Terrorblade is a carry hero, not a slower/chaser. Not to mention if you get Skadi then it will mess up with your mana break orb effect from diffusal/manta. Diffusal is a must have for Terrorblade. It gives your images a significant damage boost (and mana drain) and it gives you a purge/slow effect which TB desperately needs to kill non-noobs. After that Butterfly or MKB pending the situation. Not getting diffusal on image based heroes is just silly.