PvT: Beating m&ms+tanks on LT?

[Mopy]

I have recently gotten back into Starcraft and have been playing regularly against my friends. However, I seem to be having problems with one friend in particular. He plays Terran and early on masses marines, setting up bunkers at the chokehold of his base. He avoids getting an expansion at all and instead focuses entirely on getting m&ms and then teching to factories. Once he has one or two tanks and is researching siege mode he starts attacking me. With a huge mob of m&ms and his tanks he makes short work of my units no matter what I do. I've tried going for the early expansion but that slows down my production big time so when he attacks, shortly after the expansion is finished, he destroys the base. I've tried zealot rushing but he usually has one or two bunkers by that time so they go down quickly. I can't figure out how to beat this strategy. He doesn't have any micro skills, only the ability to mass a large army and bulldoze my base. Any ideas on how I can effectively crush this attack or even prevent it from happening? Also I know that once I stop that, unless his economy is crippled he will simply mass tanks. Any ideas on how to beat massed tanks? I apologize if these questions are noobish, I never was very good at SC:frustrate .

[Phoenix2003]

If you know he's going for marines(according to your post), then go for reavers or templars. If he's not rushing you, building up his attack force, you should take your nat while teching to reavers/shuttle.(or temps) Learn some build orders. Its been a while(since I've played this game) but, its standard to go 1 gate robo(and its variants) on LT so making reavers/shuttle to counter is a good idea.

Off the top of my head, it goes a little something like this:

gateway
assimilator
pylon
dragoon
robo facility

and then at some point make another gateway or get range for your goons.

As far as mass tanks go, speed zealots attacking from multiple directions and/or zeals in shuttles.

BTW, should you choose to expand like I suggested, cut probe production for a while making gateways and units.

Hope this helps.

[Bizzy Bone]

Its hard fighting terran on Lt, Especailly if they do the siege on the ledge of your expo ><!!

But FOr Marines and medics is ezy, get templars. Storm them and watch them all die.
This is what i do against just about any race and I win 3 out of five games.
Dragoons/Zealots/High templars.
Have your zealots specificaly hit the tanks and have goons attacking the tanks. If he has no micro he will probaly be nooby and not kill the templs, So heres your chance to storm. i usually get a gang of them, 5-6 and do a nice storm of the marines and medics.
Also U should probaly try to get Dts.
Another method would be to get corsairs Disruption web and disrupt it on the tanks and them just storm or have goons attack them since if Your units go under the web they also stop attacking too.


DONT STOP MAKING PROBES DO NOT LISTEN TO HIM. I use to stop making probes after I thought i had a exceptional amount and i would get owned in ways that I Knew i could beat.After i started making probes throughout the WHole game I noticed my Income and production of units is ALOT better. ANd yes this works on low money, since thats All i play. IF u want i can show you MANY pro replays of protoss and other races.

[ArMeD_SuRvIvOr]

DT rush will probably kill him. Or else go reavers/shuttle and drop in the mining line. HT's take care of rines, DT's might own everything, dweb will stop tanks from firing so use your reavers/goons to own him.

[Phoenix2003]

To BizzyBone: Yeah, its tricky fighting terrans on LT. That's why I avoid playing on Temple all the time, but dropping terrans are the least of your worries. Its deciding whether to do a 1 gate or 2 gate opening. Then there's the fact when you get positions where he has a very short distance to push you from.(ie. 12 v 3 or 3 v 12)

Making corsairs was a bad suggestion. There's no need for them.

And the cutting probe production suggestion was in case you're doing early expansion and terran decides to rush you and you can make units to beat it. Of course, after you beat the rush, then you should resume. Besides, Toss eco > Terran eco early in the game, so you won't fall behind when cutting probe production temporarily.

[Bizzy Bone]

Well, ive tried the zealots. stimmed rines own them. ive done it and its been done on me.
That is a hard postion though, siege tankes and medics and rines.
Corsairs would be good, Web the tanks, They stop attacking, u storm or use reavers and goons got the range ( Of course youll have weapon upgrades and range. )
I seem to ALWAYS get dropped, Well I use to not anymore since ive produced more probes and i get more units.
But whats wrong with mass producing probes? more workers = more money
I think 4-5 dt's would own him period though. Dts solely get the tanks and your storm or reavers will own the rines

[Phoenix2003]

Teching to corsairs for d-web is too expensive. Not to mention unreliable due to the high mana cost to cast d-web.

Doing a 2 gate ranged goons > templars(or 1 gate robo > reavers) is just fine. And if my opponent is staying in his base(building up his forces), I can safely take my nat while doing all of this, beat his attack, expand again and win.(no way P should lose at this point unless he gives it away.)

Most Ts who do bacanic(m&m/tank) often rush before you can get either reavers or temps so range for your goons is important in stalling while teching to either or. Have your goons stationed at his choke. FF on the marines so they die before the heal, pull back a bit, and repeat. If he stims, then his rines will melt that much quicker. Ideally, by the time he gets to your choke, should have a temp or 2 with storm.

[Bizzy Bone]

Yea, YOure right it does take to much time and expenses. Plus they would be a waste of money Just for d-web.

Do you play on Uswest? I would like to play with you, tho ih avent played in several months so i lost my skill.

[Phoenix2003]

Originally Posted by Bizzy Bone

Do you play on Uswest? I would like to play with you, tho ih avent played in several months so i lost my skill.

If only you asked me this 2 years ago, I'd take you up on that offer, but I stopped playing since I no longer have my CD-ROM because I moved. I'm sure they're other players here who would, though. I only come by once in a while to check the SC strat forum.

[Bizzy Bone]

haha
how long u been playing it for?

[Phoenix2003]

I've started playing at Jan.(maybe Feb) 2003 and ended at fall of 2005.