why the crap are you religious!

[Nosferatu-Kutsuu]

ok im just curious. i do NOT belive in religion at all but i think ill find your veiws better, try to convince me why you think religion is a good think or why do you belive in a certan religion. :lucifer

[shutupandgoaway]

Religion is beneficial because it gives people hope for the fulfillment of some sort of divine plan, and in an afterlife. Religion also brings many people off the streets, and people that would live badly to live better. I believe in Christianity first because of personal experience, which is not at all a good piece of evidence to argue from, and then from other things.

The first assumption Christianity makes is that there is a God. If there is not a God, religion is worthless. I believe in God for several reasons. First, because the world exists. Something had to have either intelligently designed the world, or have set into motion the sequence of evolution. By the way, I don't believe in evolution, but I'm smart enough to realize that evolution in no way refutes belief in God and that it's really not that big of a threat to Christianity, which is a point that much of the Christian establishment could do well to take. Secondly, because of absolutes I believe in God. This one is more complex, so bear with me. People are born with a sense of right and wrong. If you don't believe in that, I can prove that to whoever disagrees, but for now I'll take it as a universally accepted principle. Wise people before Christ have come to the same ethical, social, and philosophical principles as Christ's teachings held to be true, without influence of the Hebrew nation. The fact that everyone knows certain things to be right and wrong shows that there is either some sort of extremely odd evolutionary thing, or that God implanted certain laws into our mental makeup. These are, I believe, the two strongest philosophical reasons for which I believe in God.

Now, with simply God's existence, Christianity is not proven- Islam, Judaism, Zoroastrianism, Rastafrianism, Hinduism...etc, etc, could well be proven in the same way. However, Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ. The next step in proving Christianity to be true is to prove the deity of Christ.

Christ was either a raving lunatic, a liar, or God.He could not have simply been a great moral teacher, as a great moral teacher, especially one who had been raised a Jew, would not claim to be God, as he would know that it was a blasphemous and wicked thing to do, especially if it brought so many to believe him, as it did. A raving lunatic would be capable of claiming what Christ claimed with impunity, but thousands of people would not have flocked to a raving lunatic, and thousands of people did flock to Christ. If they had not, the Jewish leaders would not have had him crucified, as he would not have been a threat to them. A liar of diabolical proportions would have done this as well- being a person so horrifically wicked that he wished a huge group of followers to live in a lie, and to get others to live in the same lie. He could not have been a liar, as a liar would not die for their lie, especially be such a painful way of execution as crucifixion, especially if he had so many chances to recant. That leaves the possibilty that He was who he said he was, the Son of God, and the only way to salvation.

[Forged]

Religon is the Opiate of the masses
~Carl Marx

I think that kinda explains religon in a quick sentence.

[AvalonX]

yeah.. what shutupandgoaway said o.O

[VegetaClam]

Believing in Santa Claus is fun. They like getting shit for Xmas. Once you've tasted the blood at the end of the rainbow it kind of changes how you see things. It's the Flesh I'd invest in.. the spirt is rather unsubstantial.

-Vegeta Clam

[SouLess]

Originally posted by Nosferatu-Kutsuu
. i do NOT belive in religion at all but i think ill find your veiws better, try to convince me why you think religion is a good think or why do you belive in a certan religion. :lucifer

If you don't believe in religions at all, no one's going to say anything that will change that (truthfully about their respected religion)

[Nosferatu-Kutsuu]

good point well made

[TrongaMonga]

Originally posted by Grieving Mendacity
If you don't believe in religions at all, no one's going to say anything that will change that (truthfully about their respected religion)

That's not entirely true. He may hear things that will convince him of converting himself to some religion. Who knows?

Either way, I think religion is just a sort of a way to control the masses.

It works.

[raDixGhost]

We need entertainment, we don't like to be bored.

[minny]

being religious doesnt hurt you. deal with it

[c9h13no3]

I'm curious as to what makes him think a group of individuals that get together on specific days of the week and try to help each other live more moral and better lives is a bad thing.

[TrongaMonga]

It's a bad thing when they send out some planes to blow things. And doesn't have to be planes.

[Forged]

Originally posted by c9h13no3
I'm curious as to what makes him think a group of individuals that get together on specific days of the week and try to help each other live more moral and better lives is a bad thing.

Because they aren't living moral lives to what society deems moral they are living what their diety says is moral. Then these religous people get this holier than tho attitude and try and force you into their cult were they worship gods and think some guy they sacrificed is their path into some holy place.

Religon destroys peoples individuality, it causes them to do things they wouldn't normally do. For what? Some make believe god with a make believe happy place?

[shutupandgoaway]

That is sometimes the case, forged, but not always, or even the majority of the time. Most of the time, the morals of the deity match the morals of society, or are better. Religion can destroy indivinduality, but so can political parties, or unions, or pretty much any other large organizations. What you say is true in some cases, but not in most.

[c9h13no3]

Originally posted by Forged
Because they aren't living moral lives to what society deems moral they are living what their diety says is moral. Then these religous people get this holier than tho attitude and try and force you into their cult were they worship gods and think some guy they sacrificed is their path into some holy place.

Religon destroys peoples individuality, it causes them to do things they wouldn't normally do. For what? Some make believe god with a make believe happy place?

First off, the hypocrites are a small portion of religion. Go to a local church or two, and talk to some people there. I bet they don't give a damn that you don't believe in God. Or at least that's been my experiance with 95% of Christians.

And what's really funny about that second quote you had, is I feel your view on religion has destroyed YOUR individuality. You sound like a mindless automaton, droning out the same BS that all the other anti-religion people before you have thrown out. Where's the individuality in that?

The people I know that became Christians that were wild and deviant before are still wild and deviant. And the people who became Christians who were uptight and devout, are still that way. I seriously believe that it doesn't destroy personalities, it just adds to them.

And what things are you in referance to? Being kind for once? And if you're referring to things like communion, that's done about 4-6 times a year in most modern churches these days. Many churches are much less ritualistic.

And lastly, to say that it's some "make believe happy place" is ridiculous. A lot of the people who are Christians don't do what they do just for heaven. They feel good about helping others, and they enjoy the social enviroment Church creates.

Your points of view have been highly influenced by the media and the public image of Christianity that you've taken in, and it shows. It's not a knock on the media that they print//show what will be watched, but you have to take things they show with a grain of salt.

The majority of Christians are good people who want to do things to help others, find inner happiness, and who try to do the right things in life. The majority of Churches hold the same ideals. If you're going to knock the entire Church because of a minority, then I'm going to call the whole BattleForums retarded due to the actions of just you.

[Forged]

I bet they don't give a damn that you don't believe in God

Probally not but it is that minority that pisses me off

And what's really funny about that second quote you had, is I feel your view on religion has destroyed YOUR individuality

Sure why not, With religon you are given a set of rules to follow that you must follow, and you must praise and worship a god or else you go to hell. This means you can't do what you want to do, because this god is ever watchful.

The people I know that became Christians that were wild and deviant before are still wild and deviant.

I was't aware that christians could pop e at partys and ****..

And what things are you in referance to? Being kind for once? And if you're referring to things like communion, that's done about 4-6 times a year in most modern churches these days. Many churches are much less ritualistic.

huh?

A lot of the people who are Christians don't do what they do just for heaven.

So if there was no hell people would still be nice and worship some omni powerful asshole for a messiah?

Your points of view have been highly influenced by the media and the public image of Christianity

The public opinon of christianity seems to be a good one. Atleast in redneckville texas where I live.

I'm going to call the whole BattleForums retarded

And you wouldn't be to far off

[Forged]

If you break the law of a country you go to jail or are killed if you are cought. Same thing.

The only viable laws humans have are there to protect other humans from us. Not only that, but we as a group decide on these laws, they aren't just thrust onto us. If we have a question about a law we take the said law to court and try and get it revoked. If you try and argue with god you go to hell.

[Roach Of Discord]

And what's really funny about that second quote you had, is I feel your view on religion has destroyed YOUR individuality. You sound like a mindless automaton, droning out the same BS that all the other anti-religion people before you have thrown out. Where's the individuality in that?

And you don't think allot of christians are mindless drones? Almost every christian that I know, are christian's because it's how they were raised. They weren't shown and taught multiple religions, christianity is all they know. They were never taught to look at other options...so they just believe what their parents want them to believe.

Yes, of course someone raised in a christian household could become something else, but chances are they will follow the families beliefs.

[Xenoce]

Personally, I believe that religion in general is a bad thing. Spirituality is a great thing, but when transformed into a religion it becomes tainted and corrupted. The reason for this is that never in the world has there EVER been anything so destructive as religion. Religion is quite possible the easiest thing ever drempt up by humans that someone would kill or hurt over.

Religion in general has started more wars then any other single thing. The crusades were initiated because the muslums had taken control of the "holy land" and the priests said that it would be a good idea to get it back. And people killed in mass quantities for it. 9-11 itself happened because some religious fanatics decided that they would be wisked streight to heaven for killing thousands of people. Saddam Hussein, Bin Laden, most every such leader uses religion as a means/justification for control. That and torture. They go hand-in-hand. The current war in Iraq has a major religious component to it--- Bush's. And you see what Bush is trying to do in the name of his almighty "Gawd"? Remove some basic civil rights from the American people.

Now, I admit that our constitution was based on the principal of Divine Law. But persoanlly, I believe that so-called Divine Law has some flaws. It's a good starting point, but it has some flaws. Considerably more then, say, secular Humanism.

Secular Humanism is what it sounds. It is a belief system that states that Humanity is it's own driving force, and can only be "saved" through it's own efforts. Such Humanism has a wide range of societal and personal benifets. Personal responsibility increases. It's a wonderful burden to bear knowing that the fate of Humanity rests upon humans. It's rather scary when you think of the hordes of religious who seek to find some justification for their actions through some almighty diety. Had everyone such a belief system, the world would progress like never seen before.

As said before, I believe religion to be a tool used to control and content the masses with a vision of (so eloquently put) a "happy place" after you die, if you follow the priest-imposed rules. Secular Humanism eleminates the need for such control. It removes the false mechanisms of punishment and reward, and replaces it with cause and effect.

I think that's what scares so many from it. They don't want to be responsible for their own actions. They want a diety to protect them from themselves. They like the idea of an eternity of bliss by following a set of these rules.

If considering religion, think on that.

[Jaden]

Originally posted by Forged
Religon is the Opiate of the masses
~Carl Marx

I think that kinda explains religon in a quick sentence.

Yes and im sure we all agree that Karl Marx is the person with the most authority on this subject! Communism was such a sucess in the world and all.. *rolls eyes*

I think we all misinterpret religion. In terms of a set of laws and rules i'm not religion. Christianity I believe, is not a construct etc There is a God and a Christian is merely someone who follows the teachings of Christ. I believe that in all actions and thoughts we are called to love and honour God and secondly other people. These never opose each other. God is a God of love and justice and freedom not of unreasonable legalities.

I see religion as man's interpretation of differnt belief systems, it is structure, and organisation.. characteristics that we do need in Spiriutality but not to override God or other people. I think there is alot of room for corruption in this instituional religion. However there is corruption in all aspects of humanity aswel.