Worst moment in US history?

[amrtin77]

and isnt hawaii closer to china than america? on our maps it isnt so

[bamthedoc]

Actually, Hawaii is closer to China than shown on most maps, but the archipelago is closer to the US than China.

[amrtin77]

i stand corrected. wow were really off topic

[ORC-r0x0r-ROC]

Australia is the largest country in the world, and the only one that takes up an entire continent. <-- new zealand is part of oceania too. tbh russia is undoubtly bigger than australia..

Russia doesn't stand a chance against any army! They lost a ten year war in Afganistan for goodness sake! That's just a small example<--- russia basically built afghanistan,the roads the fianancial aspects, air fields.. almost every thing you can think of. all the machine guns that afghanistan had was supplied by russia. for more info look here: http://www.bdg.minsk.by/cegi/N2/Afg/Waraf.htm

The russians who decided to take over after years of Soviet economic and military advisers had been a constant feature in Afghanistan since 1950.The Soviet General Staff must have been quite knowledgeable about the geography, economy, sociology and military forces of Afghanistan. Yet, their force commitment, initially assessed as requiring several months, lasted ten years
The americans (who hate communists.... blah blah dont want anymore communist countries) assisted the guerrillas with surface to air missiles, rocket launchers and radios ect.They had took over the country pretty quickly the 10 years was spent fighting off guerrillas who had weapons supplied by americans and russians.The russians wasnt making much of afghanistan and they were unpopular so eventualy they just left.

If you are comparing this with america's 'peace action' please note that america was at war with AL qaeda not afghanistan itself and AL qaeda wasnt supplied with the latest weapons of 2 super powers...and they didnt have to deal with all them guerrillas in the mountains and its hard to recover from a 10 year war.., they werent trying to take over..

[Kamikaze]

Russia 17,075,200 sq km (6,592,800 sq mi)
Canada 9,970,610 sq km (3,849,674 sq mi)
United States 9,629,047 sq km (3,717,796 sq mi)

The area of the commonwealth is 7,682,300 sq km (2,966,200 sq mi), and the area of the continent alone is 7,614,500 sq km (2,939,974 sq mi), making Australia the smallest continent in the world, but the sixth largest country.


hope this clears up some confusion on this off topic part of the discussion.

back on topic..

this, and this have got to be the most horrible thing to happen in u.s. history. it's exactly what the terrorists wanted, to make you live in fear in your own country.

[bamthedoc]

Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
Australia is the largest country in the world, and the only one that takes up an entire continent. <-- new zealand is part of oceania too. tbh russia is undoubtly bigger than australia..

Russia doesn't stand a chance against any army! They lost a ten year war in Afganistan for goodness sake! That's just a small example<--- russia basically built afghanistan,the roads the fianancial aspects, air fields.. almost every thing you can think of. all the machine guns that afghanistan had was supplied by russia. for more info look here: http://www.bdg.minsk.by/cegi/N2/Afg/Waraf.htm

The russians who decided to take over after years of Soviet economic and military advisers had been a constant feature in Afghanistan since 1950.The Soviet General Staff must have been quite knowledgeable about the geography, economy, sociology and military forces of Afghanistan. Yet, their force commitment, initially assessed as requiring several months, lasted ten years
The americans (who hate communists.... blah blah dont want anymore communist countries) assisted the guerrillas with surface to air missiles, rocket launchers and radios ect.They had took over the country pretty quickly the 10 years was spent fighting off guerrillas who had weapons supplied by americans and russians.The russians wasnt making much of afghanistan and they were unpopular so eventualy they just left.

If you are comparing this with america's 'peace action' please note that america was at war with AL qaeda not afghanistan itself and AL qaeda wasnt supplied with the latest weapons of 2 super powers...and they didnt have to deal with all them guerrillas in the mountains, they werent rying to take over

Actually, I wasn't comparing the US's "peace action" with Russia's war, but I would point out that the Al Queda was, essentially, ruling Afganistan when we went in there. We garnered support as we pushed the gorilla warfare tactics of the terrorist group back into the caves.




Yes. This topic is way off subject. I don't think any ammount of work can ever get it back on topic.

Nice try, BTW, Kamikaze.


I don't think "over reaction" is good, as that is what the terrorists want, but we do need to take precautions. Over zealousness never got anyone anywhere -- in reality.

[Kamikaze]

Originally posted by bamthedoc
we do need to take precautions. Over zealousness never got anyone anywhere -- in reality.

really?
you don't see Canada stopping any incomming flights because of suspected terrorist activity.
whether you want to believe it or not it's just what the terrorists wanted. you are afraid in your own country.

the only thing we need to worry about up here is how we're going to get home after going out partying tonight
sure some terrorists might come into our country, but they won't do anything to us because we have never done anything to them.

violence begets violence, it's a never ending cycle.

[bamthedoc]

I'm afraid to say that Canada is a target to terrorist, just not as high on the list as the US (#1). All democracies are targets, and all Christian nations are targets to Muslim fundementalists. Canada has so many "sleeper cells" becuase of proximity to the US. Canada doesn't harbor them, by any means, of course. They work with US Forces to flush out the cells.

I said we should take precautions; we all should. I, however, never said I was "afraid in my own nation." I'd be a few millions times more worried if I were in a Muslim nation, third world country, or Isreal. Over zealousness is the problem that airports seem to be resorting to, especially as we are currently still at "High" alert. Take precautions, but don't overstep the bounds

[ORC-r0x0r-ROC]

BAM yes al qaeda was controlling most of the goverment but i dont think afghanistan was prepared for a war and i dont think afghans would die for terrorists.The guerrillas in the caves were bombed into submission that is what america spent most its time doing.

i realy dont think the worst moment is americans being more cautious and scared

[Kamikaze]

it also comes with some of your basic freedoms being taken away in an attempt to stop any future attacks.
if that coupled with worrying about terrorist attacks every holiday and anniversary of sept 11 isn't one of the worst things that can happen to a country i don't know what is.

[XenoDancer]

What about when Clinton was discovered sharing the family pork?

[Kao]

For the worst moment in the US History.....

I'd have to say Media- the fact that they cover up and draw out topics so long that not only do they kill the topic- they use it for cover and distracting the sheep of the US into not thinking about what really matters- being aware of your surroundings. Being aware of what our "Great Democracy" is doing in secret areas. Who gives a **** if a US Soldier dies in Afghanistan? Do we really need to be talking about that 1 death 3 weeks later? Honestly, even if my own brother died, I would NOT want to see the Media STILL talking about him weeks later...

[Kuzmich]

Guru's birth

[mistro5000]

prison camps for japanese lookin people in ww2
or columbine

[usemapsettings]

:fwink i think the worst moment in americas history was the nukelear bomb now north korea and such are threats to the whole world :scary

[Kuzmich]

Originally posted by ORC-r0x0r-ROC
Australia is the largest country in the world, and the only one that takes up an entire continent. <-- new zealand is part of oceania too. tbh russia is undoubtly bigger than australia..

Russia doesn't stand a chance against any army! They lost a ten year war in Afganistan for goodness sake! That's just a small example<--- russia basically built afghanistan,the roads the fianancial aspects, air fields.. almost every thing you can think of. all the machine guns that afghanistan had was supplied by russia. for more info look here: http://www.bdg.minsk.by/cegi/N2/Afg/Waraf.htm

The russians who decided to take over after years of Soviet economic and military advisers had been a constant feature in Afghanistan since 1950.The Soviet General Staff must have been quite knowledgeable about the geography, economy, sociology and military forces of Afghanistan. Yet, their force commitment, initially assessed as requiring several months, lasted ten years
The americans (who hate communists.... blah blah dont want anymore communist countries) assisted the guerrillas with surface to air missiles, rocket launchers and radios ect.They had took over the country pretty quickly the 10 years was spent fighting off guerrillas who had weapons supplied by americans and russians.The russians wasnt making much of afghanistan and they were unpopular so eventualy they just left.

If you are comparing this with america's 'peace action' please note that america was at war with AL qaeda not afghanistan itself and AL qaeda wasnt supplied with the latest weapons of 2 super powers...and they didnt have to deal with all them guerrillas in the mountains and its hard to recover from a 10 year war.., they werent trying to take over..

First Russia is the largest country in the world, second we had all the perestroyka stuff going on so that explains how we lost a war, third Russian army can put up a good fight to anyone who dares to chellenge as, we re just not that good at fighting small groups of people hiding in the forests. Besides Athganistan is not yet lost we can always come back there, then they dont expect it. Just capture the capitol in a couple of days and then bomb every cave and every forest in there. That will show em.

[SmashBros.Pro]

I think the worst thing in U.S. history is the attack on the World Trade Center. The reason I say this is because it was a cowardly and gutless attack which sparked what is going on overseas right now. Because of Osama, so many people have lost loved ones and everyday people are losing more because of the fighting going on in Iraq right now.

If we ever catch Osama death penalty wouldn't be good enough...

[Kamikaze]

Originally posted by SmashBros.Pro
I think the worst thing in U.S. history is the attack on the World Trade Center. The reason I say this is because it was a cowardly and gutless attack.

i think you have been brainwashed by your governments propaganda. i don't in any way condone what happened, but to think that someone who is willing to die for what they believe in is cowardly is quite a statement.
by your reasoning kamikaze pilots in WWII we're gutless cowards.

what do you think that the iraqi army thought of your tactics in the gulf war?
aerial bombardment for a week followed by artillery fire for several days then sending in armoured divisions to clean up the few remaining soldiers who managed to survive.
this against an enemy whos most powerful weapons we're surplus WWII russian tanks.

was this a cowardly action on americas part, or was it something that had to be done to in order to achieve your desired objective with minimal casualties to you and your allies?

[amrtin77]

he means they are cowardly cuz they DIRECTLY attack citvilians instead of trying to take on our government and military. japaneese in ww2 fought soldiers, not defenseless civs. we never directly attacked civilians.

i do agree however that it was a bit unnessicary, but look at our casualties now, 300 maybe? thats nothing, yet people here freak over it. we have to minimize our casualties cuz this war is too damn televised.

[Kamikaze]

Originally posted by amrtin77
we never directly attacked civilians.

maybe not in iraq, but.....


March 10, 1945, when, as the Times correspondent Howard French wrote, "a fleet of American B-29 bombers dropped 1,665 tons of napalm-filled bombs on Tokyo."

Sixteen square miles of the city went up in flames and 100,000 perished in a single night. Although scores of similar incendiary raids on Japanese cities followed, their memory, even in Japan, seems to have been obliterated by the mushroom clouds over Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

that sounds like 3 direct attacks on civilians to me.

here are 3 interesting quotes.

"War is immensely expensive and consumes supplies in huge quantities and that money and those supplies have to come from someplace. Civilians pay the taxes and civilians work in the factories that make planes and tanks and guns and rifles and ammunition; they mine the ore, they work in the power plants, they grow the food, they weave the cloth, everything used by the soldiers was created by a civilian somewhere."

"civilians support the government politically in its efforts to fight a war. When they lose their will to fight, it becomes very difficult for a government to continue."

"In modern warfare, even when you're not using nuclear weapons, it is not possible to fight only an enemy's army and defeat it. You don't defeat armies, you defeat their logistics, and the only way to do that is to attack the civilians who provide those logistics by attacking factories and warehouses and ports, and to attack supply lines and accept the fact that civilians in the area will be killed. You attack the merchant shipping and kill the civilian sailors on those ships. The military refers to this as "collateral damage" but it's a fact of life: it isn't possible to spare civilians in a modern war. In the Gulf War, the weeks of bombing in preparation for the ground advance mainly concentrated on the rear, to break command and control and supply lines. With those things gone, the front line troops hardly put up a fight."


as disturbing as it may be, it seems to me that civilians are an excellent military target.